2021-02-17 Special Meeting
NEW HANOVER COUNTY BOARD OF COMMISSIONERS BOOK 34
SPECIAL MEETING, FEBRUARY 17, 2021 PAGE 793
ASSEMBLY
The New Hanover County Board of Commissioners met for a Joint Special Meeting with the Wilmington City
Council on Wednesday, February 17, 2021, at 9:00 a.m. at the Wilmington Convention Center, 10 Convention Center
Dr., Wilmington, North Carolina.
Members present: Chair Julia Olson-Boseman; Vice-Chair Deb Hays; Commissioner Jonathan Barfield, Jr.
(remote); Commissioner Bill Rivenbark; and Commissioner Rob Zapple.
Staff present: County Manager Chris Coudriet (remote); County Attorney Wanda Copley; and Clerk to the
Board Kymberleigh G. Crowell.
City of Wilmington Councilmembers present: Mayor Bill Saffo; Mayor Pro-Tem Margaret Haynes (remote);
Councilmembers Neal Anderson; Clifford Barnett, Sr. (remote); Kevin O’Grady; Charlie Rivenbark; and Kevin Spears
(remote).
City of Wilmington staff present: City Manager Sterling Cheatham; City Attorney John Joye; and City Clerk
Penny Spicer-Sidbury.
Chair Olson-Boseman and Mayor Saffo called their respective Boards to order for the Special Meeting
reporting that the purpose of the meeting is to discuss priorities and possible partnerships.
NEEDS OF UNSHELTERED (HOMELESS) POPULATION
Mayor Saffo stated the City of Wilmington (City) has always had an unsheltered population and in the past,
the City worked with the County on the Ten Year Plan on Homelessness. Since Hurricane Florence, there has been a
noticeable increase in the number of homeless and unsheltered. Further, 20% of the homeless population are
chronically homeless, which is defined as those that have been homeless for at least two years. Many of those people
have substance abuse and mental health issues that affect the way they live and their ability to gain employment.
He stated he would like to see what can be done from a City and County perspective on this issue.
Councilmember Rivenbark stated there will never be a City with zero homeless population and the number
will continue to grow with increases in the population. He envisioned a project such as the tiny houses near
Greenfield Lake that would provide housing options. There have also been suggestions about the possibility of a day
center where people could go and receive the wrap around services they need, including it being a place to shower
and clean their clothes. It would not be inexpensive and would require the political will to do it.
Councilmember O'Grady stated there are local resources already available that could be drawn on and
suggested that those avenues be explored first to determine the full scope of what those resources offer. Lakeside
is a local success story as an example of addressing this issue and there is a need for more places just like it. There is
a need for balance between decent living conditions for the unsheltered population, while still being respectful to
the rest of the population.
Commissioner Zapple stated that part of the frustration is matching people to the services that are available
through the County Health and Human Services Department (HHS) and he further commended the work of the HHS
staff on this issue. Strengthening the relationships with local nonprofits is a good step to finding permanent housing
solutions and those services should be brought together for the homeless population.
Commissioner Rivenbark stated there are two groups of people, with one group being those that have been
kicked out of day centers and group homes and are unable to return. These are usually the people that are seen in
the downtown area.
Commissioner Barfield stated there are vacant hotels in the area that can serve as transitional housing,
which has been done in other areas. This issue will take more than providing the current levels of funding, and will
require long-term funding of some type of sustainable housing. At the start of the pandemic, the County put up
resources to house the homeless in order to stop the spread of Covid-19. He feels that should be done on a long-
term basis. County Manager Coudriet stated that County staff has not put together any specific proposals. The
County and the City are involved in funding the Continuum of Care and the Good Shepherd Center. He confirmed
Commissioner Barfield’s point that while those are not big steps, there are things happening on the periphery. Staff
would take leads from the elected bodies’ suggestions to provide a consolidated County/City approach.
Councilmember Anderson stated that he likes the idea of partnering with groups that have this issue as
their sole focus. The City Council has asked the City Manager to reach out to the developer of Eden Village, which is
transitional housing, to discuss its program. He also would like to see the City partner with groups that have these
new concepts and that this issue needs to be on the front burner. He agreed with Commissioner Rivenbark’s point
that there are two populations and noted that even the population that chooses to be unsheltered should have
access to hygiene facilities and healthcare.
Mayor Pro-Tem Haynes stated she agreed with the points already made adding that the only programs that
are successful are those that have access to services and that it will not be good enough to only provide a bed.
Lakeside and Eden Village will both provide those wrap around services. Public money can be used to incentivize
those in the private sector to step up and she stated that she was in favor of promoting the idea of a public/private
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partnership. Furthermore, if the public sector can create some type of umbrella plan, the private sector may help to
achieve it.
Councilmember Barnett agreed with the necessity of having available wrap around services. There is a need
to think about ways to prevent homelessness in the first place.
Vice-Chair Hays stated she is also in favor of partnering with the experts who already exist in the community
and agreed that there are levels of homelessness, but that everyone should have a clean place to rest and wash their
clothes. The residents of Lakeside and Eden Village are those who demonstrate that they want to move out of the
homeless arena. She further stated she is in favor of City and County staff working together to put together a plan.
Councilmember Rivenbark stated that when issues such as the opioid crisis emerge, the County, with the
City’s help through the zoning process, is in the process of building the addiction treatment center. The Wilmington
Metropolitan Planning Organization (WMPO) is constructing a building on Fourth Street. These are examples that
reflect that the City and County can find ways to do things and he noted that this issue has been around for a long
time. The experts have to be involved, but the City and County have to take the lead. He would like to see funds that
are coming from the federal government to go towards a shovel ready project that would meet some of these
demands. He further noted that there are some that choose this lifestyle, but with a city this size, this is something
that needs to be planned for now in order to be ready.
Commissioner Barfield stated that reports from groups such as the Ten Year Plan on Homelessness will give
the answers to these problems. He stated the answers have been there, but they need to be put into practice and it
is the government’s job to put money on the table to make these things happen.
Chair Olson-Boseman requested that staff set another meeting in two months to bring back options. Mayor
Saffo concurred. Mayor Pro-Tem Haynes stated she would like to see an option to have a shelter that accepts people
as they are, regardless of their addictions or mental illnesses. However, such a facility would have to be highly staffed
and would not be cheap.
Councilmember Barnett commented on the importance of the lessons learned from the temporary housing
program during the pandemic.
Commissioner Zapple stated the conversation is centered on persistent homelessness. He suggested that
since the homeless camp locations are known, maybe conducting an inventory would be a good starting point to get
an idea of the size and scope, and then measure the services that would be needed to address it.
Mayor Saffo requested that staff gather information on how other counties are addressing this issue and in
particular how they interact with Wilmington and New Hanover County. He feels that people migrate to Wilmington
because that is where the services are available. Information he has received from City staff shows that this area
receives less money than areas such as Buncombe County, Asheville, High Point, and some of the other smaller
communities. He would like to know why and what it would take to increase those amounts for this area. There will
be issues with placing facilities in the City and being able to address the concerns of the neighbors. He agreed with
earlier comments that Lakeside is a great example of having supportive housing with wrap around services. He also
agreed that the concept of a day shelter should be looked into as well as working with homeless advocacy groups in
order to have a clear plan of how they will work together.
Vice-Chair Hays stated an idea is to not have one central location, but rather several smaller locations
throughout the City and the County. That idea may help with potential backlash from neighbors.
Councilmember Anderson stated he would like to see staff’s approach on helping the Salvation Army move
forward. Mayor Saffo stated at one point there was a roadway that would allow that location to bypass the
community and agreed on the need to have additional information on that project.
RISE TOGETHER/INCLUSION COLLABORATIONS: EDUCATION/BROADBAND FOR ALL CITIZENS
Mayor Saffo stated that the social unrest that occurred over the summer brought forward certain issues,
including that 25% of the population is living in poverty. One of the things the City would like to work on is focusing
on the three to four significant areas of poverty identified through GIS, which would encompass the issues of
healthcare, housing, jobs, and education. The City would like to work jointly with the County on these issues affecting
the community. One issue that has been discussed is the digital divide, with school children being given tablets, but
unable to connect to the internet. There are hotspots set up in areas, but it is not a realistic solution for a child to sit
in a car for hours to complete schoolwork. He stated that he hopes the City and County can work together on this
issue, and perhaps bring in the Wilmington Housing Authority. He stated other issues include food deserts, such as
near Greenfield Street.
Councilmember Barnett stated one idea is to get to issues early and he feels it is critical to work on early
childhood prevention and programs. He feels working with the two to three-year-old daycare programs will affect
and prevent things that can happen later on as those programs prepare children for school, the workforce, and the
future. There is a need to look at highly qualified programs in these areas.
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Councilmember O’Grady commented on his work with broadband and cable and the remarkable thing is
that broadband exists all over the City. The issue comes with getting it from the street to a home, which costs money.
He feels there needs to be a lobbying effort to have the franchise rules changed so that there is a different scale for
low income households. Those households should have highly discounted access to internet so that those children
will be able to work in their homes. He stated getting the internet that last 25 feet, from the pole to the house, is
the biggest hurdle and the issue will require a statewide negotiation to put that second scale into place.
Mayor Saffo stated the cities of Salisbury and Wilson initiated broadband deployment and made it
universally available throughout their communities. There was significant pushback from the telecommunications
industry and it was a big loss for municipalities that were trying to help its citizens. He stated if we do this as a
community, we need to understand what it would look like and what the cost would be, as the City could not be
reimbursed for those expenses and it would have to function as a subsidy. He supported Councilmember O'Grady’s
idea to lobby, but he feels if they want to be aggressive about this issue, they should get an idea of the immediate
cost and if there’s a mechanism to provide additional funding.
Commissioner Zapple stated he agrees with Mayor Saffo’s comments and that the pandemic has only
heightened the need for people to have internet access in their home as it is not just for education, but many jobs
require internet access. The North Carolina Association of County Commissioners (NCACC) has lobbied for expanding
broadband access at all levels. He would like to expand the conversation to include Corning, as it is largest provider
of fiber optic cable.
Commissioner Barfield stated out of North Carolina’s 100 counties, 85 are rural and many have no access
to broadband and WiFi connectivity. This community is leaps and bounds ahead of its neighbors, but it will still be a
challenge.
Chair Olson-Boseman directed County staff to work on ideas to expand access in the County and how that
can be accomplished. She stated the County is on board to work with the City on this issue.
Councilmember Anderson agreed with Councilmember O'Grady’s assessment and stated that post
pandemic there should be somewhere people can go and sit to work. Any County or City buildings or facilities could
be used to provide spaces where people can access the internet. He also acknowledged this is a real challenge during
the pandemic, but afterwards, he feels the issue can be addressed to a certain extent.
Councilmember O'Grady stated another issue is where franchisees decide to put their cable, as they could
decide to only run in certain areas. There is a need to have information on where companies have cables and they
should be required to provide it everywhere, with no cherry-picking of certain areas. He suspects it is everywhere in
the City, but the issue will be getting it the last 25 feet to the houses.
Councilmember Rivenbark stated the short term solution is to get children back into school and that it has
been proven that kids and teachers are safer in schools. This issue should be addressed for future situations, as trying
to have children in cars doing homework is not a sustainable solution.
Councilmember Spears stated in discussing the digital divide, there needs to be a focus on jobs and livable
wages. Citizens want to know what the City and County are doing to bring employers to the areas that will provide
a livable wage. He stated having better paying jobs will help with these other issues.
Mayor Saffo commented that the first part of the jobs issue is working with economic development partners
and the second part is that there has been an increase in job creation. The type of education needed to get those
jobs will also be an important factor. The County has done a great job with the School Board in creating opportunities
for those who do not want to go to college, but would rather learn a technical skill or vocation. From a job creation
point of view, there are some that will require higher education and others that will require technical skills, and both
are very important.
Councilmember Spears stated that the government also needs to set a standard as to the types of systemic
hiring practices that should eradicated. There are people in the area right now that have degrees and are not
working, so it will be even harder for those without degrees to find employment.
Councilmember Anderson inquired about the effort to provide water and sewer in the Highway 421
corridor. He would like to hear if that effort has produced any results, in terms of new businesses and job creation.
Mayor Saffo stated there has been tremendous success at with Pender Park and that same type of effort is
being duplicated in the Blue Clay Road area. He further stated it is critical to have the infrastructure in place.
Commissioner Barfield stated zoning plays a role in that as well. Mayor Saffo commented that zoning and land
availability will be issues in New Hanover County and focus has been on the Highway 421 corridor as it already has
an industrial feel to it.
Commissioner Rivenbark stated that companies that relocate here want to be near Interstate 40. The
majority of the land in that area is owned by a couple of families who want to develop, but will need water and
sewer and this might be a good partnership opportunity. Mayor Saffo also stated there is another industrial
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development that has broken ground on the 74/76 Corridor. He further stated the area is getting a lot of interest,
especially with the infrastructure improvements at the state port.
Vice-Chair Hays stated that one of the mainstays of the community is the entrepreneurship of small
businesses, which have been affected by Covid-19. Genesis Block is working to launch minority and women owned
businesses and ensure they have the skills to succeed. She stated there is entrepreneurship in the area and everyone
should keep the smaller businesses in mind while working towards bringing those larger businesses to the area.
Vice-Chair Hays stated she has been focused on the digital divide and this should be a top priority for the County and
agreed that getting children back into school is a priority.
Mayor Saffo requested that staff meet with the New Hanover County School Board to discuss particular
schools where there are issues with underserved populations. The School Board will have a lot of quantitative
information that can help with this issue.
Commissioner Zapple stated the work on the Highway 421 corridor infrastructure is paying huge dividends.
There are tremendous amounts of land being cleared with developers building speculative buildings to spark
interest. A large part will be providing the water pressure needed for the fire flow required for certain warehouses
and manufacturing. While it is taking some time, it is paying off. He also feels that part of the success of the Pender
County Commerce Park is its proximity to Wilmington and New Hanover County. It goes towards regionalism,
realizing that New Hanover is limited in square acreage.
Commissioner Barfield commented that several years ago the County had the opportunity to buy the BASF
property and set up an industrial business complex, but the Board at that time was not thinking about the future
need to bring jobs and he is glad to hear the forward-thinking conversations today. Cape Fear Community College
(CFCC) is doing an excellent job and after Hurricane Florence when it became apparent there was a need for linemen,
CFCC came up with a lineman program and graduated 35 to 40 people in that first class. Upon graduation, employers
were waiting to hire those graduates and there have been three to four additional classes since that time and those
graduates have had jobs waiting for them. He further stated that in regard to returning kids to school, he has seen
conflicting information, because when Brunswick County moved back to in-person learning, Covid-19 clusters
formed and mixed messages are going out to the public. He stated the safety of the children and the teachers should
be the priority and agreed with Vice-Chair Hays that Wilmington has strong entrepreneurship and how if a person
cannot find a job, they can make their own.
At the request of Chair Olson-Boseman, Chief Diversity and Equity Officer Linda Thompson provided
information from New Hanover County’s 120-Day Diversity and Equity Assessment. Ms. Thompson stated her staff
looked internally as to how the County is operating, as well as looking into the community. It was found that 33% of
the African-American population is living in poverty and 55% of the African-American population received benefits
for food stamps, Medicaid, or childcare vouchers in 2019. There are approximately 31,000 to 32,000 African-
Americans living in the County and over 16,000 received those benefits. There is a serious poverty issue in this
County. One of the recommendations from the assessment, which included round table discussions with local
stakeholders, was to seek out partnerships. The County is submitting a proposal to Google Partnerships, who is
looking to provide 1,500 Chromebooks and hotspots to inner-city communities. She further stated it is important to
get technology for education, working adults, and homebound seniors.
Mayor Saffo stated those are phenomenal statistics and he did not realize the numbers were that high. He
knows the hospital did a health assessment of the Northside, as that area had a high volume of emergency room
visits and indigent care costs. He is not sure what came out of that assessment, except for requests to improve Portia
Hines Park, a better relationship with police, and a grocery store, but that will not fix the healthcare problem. He
stated the Wilmington Fire Department (WFD) shared information with City Council that certain fire stations were
getting calls for health issues. It has been suggested that WFD could work with Novant and the County where people
could go to fire stations to get blood pressure checks, diabetes checks, and other routine healthcare services. He
stated he hopes that possibility is discussed further as it may avoid some larger healthcare issues. Ms. Thompson
responded that the Harrelson Center has adopted that model and provides those types of health checks. It recently
expanded into Columbus County and would be able to assist with setting up a similar program. They also have a
nurse on site to offer services to homeless and indigent people. However, it is not just the homeless, and as an
example, her late husband began a new job and did not have healthcare during the beginning 90-day window and
during that time, he had to go to the emergency room to get necessary prescriptions and services. Mayor Saffo
stated the goal would be to get to people before they get to the point where they have to go to the emergency
room. He further stated that approximately 95% of the calls that WFD receives are for health issues, not fires, so
they are looking at ways to help the community.
Councilmember Anderson stated he was excited to read about Michael Jordan’s donation for two new
clinics. Ms. Thompson stated she was not involved in that donation, but that it was in partnership with Novant. She
is also certain Novant will look for input as to where to place those clinics.
Chair Olson-Boseman directed County Manager Coudriet and Ms. Thompson to communicate with the
hospital about where those clinics will be located. She stated that maybe some of the additional services, such as
WiFi, can be offered at those locations.
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Mayor Pro-Tem Haynes stated that as to the broadband discussion, it really comes down to the state
legislature. She would like to know if there is a consensus from both governing boards to instruct their respective
lobbyists to work on this issue, so that local governments would be able to work with private providers to get
broadband into people’s homes. Mayor Saffo stated there appeared to be a consensus by the County Commissioners
and City Council to do this.
In response to questions, Ms. Thompson stated as to the percentage of non-black people living in poverty,
30.22% of the Hispanic population lives in poverty and she does not have the final number of the white population
living in poverty in the County. 19.30% of females (of all races) are living in poverty in the County. The median income
in New Hanover County is $53,419 and the income below the poverty level is $34,250 per household and the report
did not focus on school-aged children, as that data is collected by New Hanover County Schools (NHCS). As to
individuals 18-years of age, one of the recommendations is to have more vocational training and extended job
placement programs.
Councilmember Barnett stated again that his focus is on children in the pre-kindergarten age range, as it is
critical to reach them at that stage to set them up for success in the future.
Councilmember Rivenbark stated he received information from Cape Fear Public Utility Authority (CFPUA)
Executive Director Jim Flechtner that CFPUA designed the Highway 421 system to meet 1,500 gallons per minute fire
flow and depending on the project, that may be sufficient. If it is not, the site may need a storage tank and a booster
pump. He stated that prior to 2008, which is when CFPUA was created, it would have been a pipe dream to provide
water and sewer to some of these places and that everything CFPUA does is paid for by the ratepayers or grant
funds. He feels in the future there will be big things happening in that area because it is now useable.
WORKFORCE/SUPPORTIVE HOUSING SUPPORT
Mayor Saffo stated the County and City supported the creation of the joint workforce housing advisory
committee to provide recommendations on workforce/supportive housing support. Over the last couple of years,
the City has had opportunities to work with private developers on affordable housing and the County had a similar
opportunity in the Castle Hayne area. He requested that the committee provide a report during the next joint
meeting on its recommendations and plan of action. He further stated the information is there and it would be a
matter of the boards coming together to determine what they want to support.
Vice-Chair Hays agreed that this is a very important issue and that separate time should be set aside for the
report to be presented and discussed by both governing bodies. The information will be necessary to move forward.
Commissioner Barfield agreed and stated the frustration he hears is that these groups bring information
forward, but nothing happens. It comes down to putting money into these conversations and he is ready to put
things in place. It will be impossible to retain a younger workforce when the median home price is $325,000.
ADDRESSING TRAFFIC/TRANSPORTATION NEEDS
Mayor Saffo stated there is a segment of the population that needs public transportation to get to and from
work and having a strong public transportation system is vital in moving the community forward. The issue is bigger
than just public transportation and this area is one of the fastest growing in the state. Most citizens are not
concerned with NC Department of Transportation’s (NCDOT) money issues, although most of the roadways in New
Hanover County are owned by the state. Citizens still come to the City with maintenance issues for state-owned
roadways. Rising home prices are driving people to buy homes in Brunswick and Pender counties, which creates a
significant traffic issue when people drive into the City for work. His information is that approximately 50,000 people
drive into Wilmington every day, making the traffic issue a regional problem and vehicles coming into the beach
communities also create additional traffic. He further stated that NCDOT should be making investments into this
community, but that the region also needs to look at ways to bring in additional funding. He stated this can include
a possible quarter-cent sales tax referendum that would be voted on by the citizens. The County has committed to
continue to support WAVE and to look at other alternatives in respect to funding these critical community issues.
The City has had success with bonds in the past, but it is important to show the public how and where the money
will be spent. The sales tax would capture those that come into Wilmington for the day and spend money here, and
it should be distributed amongst the municipalities and the County.
Commissioner Zapple stated he echoes Mayor Saffo’s sentiments and that traffic congestion is real and
there is a need for a rapid transit system that serves all parts of the community. He suggested a small food and
beverage tax that would target the tourist industry dollars.
Councilmember O'Grady stated he does not understand why the WAVE consultant recommended
compressing the system into the City when most of the issues being discussed, such as workforce housing, the digital
divide, and sheltering unsheltered persons will affect the County as well. There is a need for a county-wide public
transit system and in a partnership, both sides should contribute equally, and that in order to grow, the system
needs more money invested. Local money is the base, and then comes state and federal money. If local money is
not put in, the system will not receive federal dollars.
Councilmember Spears stated the presentation at the City Council Agenda Briefing last Monday covered
taxing people based on mileage and he feels that type of tax will put restraints on people. Having an adequate
transportation system would be a better option to get people to reduce their reliance on cars.
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Councilmember Anderson stated the traffic is a year-round issue and he would encourage exploring the
option of a quarter cent sales tax. He would like to see staff provide options of what can be done with the money.
The hotels may be a better avenue to target tourism, but he does not know what would be viable and feels it would
be worth the discussion.
Chair Olson-Boseman agreed with Councilmember Anderson and stated the County cannot build roads, but
agrees there are major transportation needs. She also agrees with directing staff to look at options for the sales tax
and to come back with recommendations.
Vice-Chair Hays stated she also agreed with Councilmember Anderson and that WAVE must have a
dedicated revenue stream. She also asked that staff explore the food and beverage tax option and come back with
information on what that would mean. She is also in favor of looking at raising the room occupancy tax (ROT) and
would like for both staffs to work together on these avenues.
Councilmember O'Grady stated the alternative funding methods should be considered, but he pointed out
that whatever is put in, one-half of the sales tax will be paid by those who live in Wilmington, in addition to the
annual funding provided by the City each year, which is approximately $1.4 million. County residents will also pay
the sales tax, but the Board of Commissioners does not appropriate an equal amount of annual funding to WAVE
each year. The County and the City have not been funding WAVE equally.
Commissioner Barfield stated he believes in public transportation and any major metro community has a
vibrant public transportation system. He does not understand why the consultants would reduce the route coverage
and would have preferred that the elected bodies be told what they need to know, not just what they want to hear.
A lot has been done in terms of the new transportation center and operations center. The County has not been a
true financial partner and at its inception, the County’s purpose was to relieve the burden of providing Medicaid
transportation. The County’s contribution to WAVE has been limited to those services and not much more. The
County did agree to fund one-half of the fund balance, but overall the local government’s contributions are miniscule
for WAVE’s overall budget. Portions of WAVE’s budget relating to rural funding were cut and in those situations they
turned to their local funding partners. He spoke to the previous director, Albert Eby, about the sales tax who stated
he was not sure WAVE had the capacity to spend the money that would be generated and suggested the motor
vehicle tax may be more in line with its capacity. He stated decreasing the routes to 20 minutes instead of an hour
will help to create by-choice riders and that it will be important to come to the table with the right resources to level
the playing field.
Councilmember Rivenbark stated that a number of Commissioners and Councilmembers have been around
for a long time and things do not look the same as they did years ago. For some problems, it is necessary to reinvent
the wheel and provide the proper amount of funding. Mass transit will become a greater issue in the future and
work needs to be done now to be ready for it.
BREAK: Chair Olson-Boseman and Mayor Saffo called for a break from 11:07 a.m. until 11:17 a.m.
Mayor Saffo stated that to wrap up this particular topic, County and City staff have been directed to return
with options for the quarter-cent sales tax and the possibility of a food and beverage tax. He stated that when WAVE
was set up, they did not have a permanent funding source. The City would like to see more equity between the City
and County funding amounts. As to if any special legislation or adjustments would be needed for a referendum,
County Manager Coudriet explained that to institute a sales tax increase for general infrastructure, and not
specifically for public transportation, there would have to be some modifications to the statute. The current
authority is narrowly drawn to allow for the increase only for public transportation. NCACC has been working to
expand the ability to institute that quarter-cent sales tax increase. He stated that staff will work with their lobbyists
as well as the City’s lobbyists on this issue. Vice-Chair Hays requested that staff also look into increasing the ROT.
Mayor Saffo stated that there are issues other than WAVE and the sales tax revenues could help with those
issues if the authority was expanded.
A brief discussion was held about high-speed rail. Chair Olson-Boseman asked if high-speed rail would
qualify as a public transportation cost for the sales tax increase. County Manager Coudriet responded that it would
qualify. Chair Olson-Boseman stated that the discussion about mass transit should be more than just buses. Mayor
Saffo stated that rail realignment is also a major issue for the City, especially considering the growth at the port and
the resulting truck traffic on Third Street. In response to questions, City Attorney Joye stated that the funding for
Charlotte’s rail to Raleigh was done through grant funding, funding from the Federal Transit Administration, and
one-half cent sales tax revenues through special legislation, which generates $75 to $80 million per year. He agreed
with County Manager Coudriet that rail to Raleigh would qualify as a public transportation for the sales tax.
Chair Olson-Boseman requested that City Attorney Joye work with County staff on exploring the possibility
of high speed rail to Raleigh. As to if this is something that could be brought to the Community Endowment for
possible funding, County Manager Coudriet stated it is something that both governing boards could bring forward
to see if it has interest in funding mass transportation.
Commissioner Zapple stated the potential revenue for the quarter-cent sales tax can be absorbed through
various projects. As to if Charlotte has a food and beverage tax, City Attorney Joye responded that he believes there
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is one, but the revenues are directed towards the hospitality industry. Commissioner Zapple stated he felt all possible
revenue streams should be looked at.
Vice-Chair Hays agreed that nothing should be taken off the table at this point. However, she is concerned
that a sales tax increase will disproportionately affect lower income citizens and those effects should be considered.
PROJECT GRACE DEVELOPMENT
Chair Olson-Boseman stated the County is moving forward with Project Grace, which will relocate the main
library and Cape Fear Museum. The County would like the City to be a partner in the project and they could look into
the County and City to have offices in the same area. If the City would consider locating some of its offices in Project
Grace, the County would look at locating satellite services there as well.
County Manager Coudriet stated that the departments, such as Code Compliance and the Tax Department,
would have synergy with City operations. There could be space for general meetings, including individual
Commissioner meetings. The County has a law enforcement presence already downtown and they are looking to
move and add spaces. There are also viable options for the County to have downtown satellite spaces.
Chair Olson-Boseman stated the County is excited about Project Grace and the possibilities it will bring
downtown. Mayor Saffo stated the next step would be to ask staff to look at the possibilities and report back with
options. The City is looking at the most efficient office spaces and what will work best for the City. He further stated
that if it makes sense for the City, he would like for the City to be a part of Project Grace.
Commissioner Barfield stated that the City Council has done a phenomenal job in transforming the Third
Street streetscape and the river walk area. When driving from the Isabella Holmes Bridge, it just opens up and is
exciting. He hopes Project Grace will be another great addition to the downtown area.
In follow-up to Vice-Chair Hay’s concern about the sales tax disproportionately affecting lower income
households, City Attorney Joye stated that the quarter-cent sales tax would not apply to groceries.
Commissioner Rivenbark stated he wanted to clear up misconceptions about Project Grace in that the
County was giving away the library. The County would end up with the building after 20 years and the Cape Fear
Museum needs additional space, and this would provide that space.
Mayor Saffo stated that the renovations the County completed at the Division of Juvenile Justice building
are phenomenal and commended the County investing in the community. He stated whether the City participates
in Project Grace or not, he knows the County will do a good job.
Vice-Chair Hays stated that Wilmington Downtown Inc. (WDI) and the Chamber of Commerce are
partnering to hold a public forum about Project Grace. It will be held online via Zoom and the credentials should
available through the County’s website. Various staff and representatives involved in the project will give an
overview of the current project and will have the ability to address questions.
Commissioner Zapple stated there has been misinformation and evolving information about Project Grace.
The downtown library will always be there, even during construction. Once the project is complete, there will be an
enhancement of services at the library and the same will be true for Cape Fear Museum.
WRAP UP AND NEXT STEPS
A brief discussion was held about holding another joint meeting in 60 days to discuss on the topics discussed
during this meeting. The County and City Clerks were requested to find a date specific for the meeting. Both
ndrd
responded that April 22 or 23 are potential meeting dates, but information would be sent out about a specific
date once the Wilmington Convention Center staff was consulted about room availability.
ADJOURNMENT
Hearing no further discussion, Chair Olson-Boseman and Mayor Saffo adjourned the meeting at 11:43 a.m.
Respectfully submitted,
Kymberleigh G. Crowell
Clerk to the Board
Please note that the above minutes are not a verbatim record of the Special Meeting of the New Hanover County
Board of Commissioners. The entire proceedings are available online at www.nhcgov.com.